Posted by akshay0910 on 01/26/13 7:31pm
I am in final year of engineering and i want to have a career in management now.i am looking forward for an MBA through GMAT but it requires a minimum 2 years of exp. and 3-5 years to get a good university.I have a job in hand but its a technical job and i dont think is of any use for mba.As i don't want to wait for 3-5 yrs i searched and get an alternative i.e. M.Sc in management which i guess is in trend in Europe.So can you suggest me what to do and what if choose this path of M.Sc what will be the future in it and what is the value of having an MIM degree.also suggest me which country i should prefer as an international student so that i can have good job opportunites after MIM
Posted by Thomas Graf on 01/27/13 11:55am
thank you for your question. I agree - the MBA is not the right program at this stage of your career. Technically, you could go for a master for recent graduates or postgraduate diploma in managemnt (PGDM). What shall you do?
I recommend you to take some time and evaluate your current career options. You have a job - that's great. Are you happy with this job or your other career options at the moment? If yes, why not working some years and consider an MBA later?
If you are not happy with your situation now - yes, then another education could make sense. Then you have three options:
I think it will help if you try to clear this question first. After that and provided that you want to do a master, you will think about the criteria that a master needs to fulfill to qualify for you. For instance, where you want to work later can be a criterion for where you want to study.
By Thomas Graf
Posted by akshay0910 on 01/27/13 6:58pm
Thank you sir for your reply,Actually i want to complete my study and then a good job.i wants to do this job only because experience is required for mba.But as i don't want to wait for 3 years i think MIM is a good option for me.and what is PGDM i don't know about it.And i wants to make a decision now for my career so that i can start preperation for GMAT or other exams.Please tell me if it is good option for me to first complete MIM and after doing job for 4-5 years, try for Executive MBA or Global MBA.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 01/28/13 12:52am
my humble opinion is: I wouldn't care so much about what you are doing 3, 5, or 7 years. You may go for an MBA or not, a fulltime, parttime, or Executive MBA or not - you do not need to decide about this now. I recommend you to free yourself from this. In some years you will think about it and then decide. Maybe you will have a great job then and no interest in an MBA anymore. Maybe you will go for an MBA. Whatever you do, it shouldn't bother you now.
For now, however, I come back to my previous posting. You can move on working and consider an MBA in some years. Or you can do a master now to enrich your cv and apply for your favorite positions after graduating. Then again you can work for some years and then think about an MBA or not.
So, the only thing that you need to clear now - in my opinion - is: Do you want a master now; and if yes - which one (a rather general master such as the MIM or a rather specific master such as a Master in Finance, or Accounting, or Marketing etc.).
If you know that you want to wokr in a specific area after graduating - e.g., in marketing or in it management - you may consider a more specialized master. If you want to keep your future more open you would rather consider a Master in Management.
Posted by akshay0910 on 01/29/13 1:34pm
Thank u sir.i have decided to continue my study as my job is not as good as i want.therefore is MIM a good option for me to enhance my knowledge and have a good job to start my career with ?And as u said that i can do a general MIM or specific master.I am from an enggineering background and i dont have idea about these finance and marketing etc.Could you please suggest me specific branch which has a great future.My main goal in life is to learn the basics of business and management so can i can start my own in future.So what will be the best option for a fresher like me to do:1.A general management or a specific for a bright future looking at the current and future demand of management guys.2.Should look for other technical exams and studies or jobs
Posted by Thomas Graf on 01/29/13 5:10pm
Hi there again,
from everything that you tell me a Master General Management (MIM) seems to be the best choice for you.
Well, than indeed a MIM program will provide you with:
I recommend you to look for programs that are named: Master in Management, Master in Business, Master in International Management, or Master in International Business.
The next step is: Think about where you want to study. 90 percent of the MIM students start their career in the country of where they studies. So, try to identify some countries of your interest first.
Then dedicate some time in gaining an overview on whoch schools in these countries offer MIM programs (e.g. use our search engine), how they are ranked, and which employers come to campus. You find this information on the schools' websites.
Posted by akshay0910 on 01/31/13 6:40pm
thank u sir,I will start preparing for GMAT and TOEFL nowon.I have a question although its awkward to ask u at my stage.What will be a minimum score of GMAT and TOEFL for me to get into Top 10 MIM university.I am a average student and these are my qualifications :
Posted by Thomas Graf on 01/31/13 8:10pm
thank you for your question. As for the TOEFL I am not sure about the current system. At my time, some years ago, a TOEFL score of 100 or more was considered as good (computer test). But again, I am not sure here.
As for the GMAT, let me emphasize some important points:
(1) Not every school requires the GMAT for the MIM program.
(2) A GMAT - even a top score - dos not "bring you into the MIM program". It may be one important criterion among others how school admissions managers assess your abilities. It is worth that you invest time in its preparation - but it does not give you a guarantee for getting a place.
Usually the minimum score for most renowned schools is 600. There are good schools that also accept 550 even if officially they say 600. And there are super-super-top schools that have average scores of 650, 690, or more than 700 - average means some are better, some are worse - here 600 may not be sufficient and I would recommend 650 for such a school as minimum.
So, to summarize:
Posted by krishna Bhardwaj on 03/02/13 6:07pm
HI AkshayPGDM means post graduate in diploma offered by prestigeous IIMs in india and other B school and it is equivalent to MIM (according to QS abd FT) meant for freshers and students with little work experience. It is generally considered as MBA in indian context.
Posted by AVINASH777 on 03/29/13 4:03pm
Hi,This is Avinash from India.I have done my engineering in 2012 and now planning to pursue MIM from Canada.
So could you please tell me that is Canada a good option or i should also go through some European Universities as i heard that the tuition fees as well as the living cost in canada is low as compare to the European countries.
and could you also suggest some good universities of Canada to pursue MIM.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 03/29/13 10:27pm
thank you for your question. I think it is too general to ask whether Canada or Europe is a great area to study. In both countries, you can study at great universities and find great jobs. It all depends...
So, my sugestion is: Choose a school in a country where you want to work later on. Ideally the school should provide you with connections to employers in that country and help you fidn a job after graduation.
Second, I recommend you to check several rankings as a first step (not for your final decision). Choose and compare several rankings to find schools in the country of your interest. For instance, the FT Master in Management Ranking but also MBA Rankings.
The next step will be: Screen the schools' websites, check if they are accredited, and have a look at the firms that come to campus to recruit. Are these the firms wher you want to work?
The next step will be that you ask the schools to bring you in contact with current students to get a closer picture on the school's culture and actual studies.
At the moment, you are still at the beginning of your search process. Take your time to reflect your goals (e.g. the country) and to get an overview on the university landscape of the country of your interest. Then you go closer step by step.
Posted by AVINASH777 on 03/31/13 6:25pm
I am planning to take IELTS exam and get into one of the best university in Canada for MIM.
So are there good and enough universities or colleges which take admissions on the basis of IELTS score? and if
so,then can you please name me universities or colleges in Canada which hold good ranking and take admissions on thebasis of IELTS score and how much score is required to get into their.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 03/31/13 9:42pm
please have a look at the Financial Times Master in Management Ranking. There you can find the HEC Montréal. Furthermore, please use our Search Engine and search for Canada + Masters in General Management + fulltime. Also, use the Entry Requirements filter to search for programs that require a first degree in business or for programs that do not - depending on your background.
I also recommend you to have a look at the CEMS MIM program and the Richard Ivey School of Business that cooperate with CEMS.
You can also search for Canadian rankings by googling for them or by checking the Business Week MBA Rankings. Whatever you do, I recommend you to look for schools that are ranked in several rankings, for instance the MBA, the MIM, or the EMBA - this gives you a signal that a school is good in teaching general management education independent of the specific program.
What you can also do is simply visit the websites of the 18 Canadian fulltime MIM programsin our database and check the firms that recruit there. Are these the firms you want to work later on? You can also find information on the IELTS there.
I understand that this research is a lot of work. But believe me it is worth it. The more time you invest now in comparing programs the more satisfied you will be later on in your studies.
Posted by AVINASH777 on 04/01/13 11:36am
I am planning to study and stay in Canada, so do you think its a good idea as i heard that the living cost of Canada is comparatively low and there are some better universities providing MIM program having low tuition fee.
I got81% in 10th71% in 12th58% in graduation.
so do you think that a declination in my graduation will it hamper in my admission or i can hope for good college.Does our extra curricular activities achievement play any role in the admission part.and also if I will give exam (IELTS) in mid may then is it possible for me to get admissions for September session.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 04/01/13 11:49am
I think studying in Canada (or the US) makes sense if you want to work there later on. Being in the country for a full year allows you to build contacts to companies - and ideally, your Master and school support you by this. In other words: I would consider choosing a school that has a interesting company network - and maybe even a program that integrates an internship or an in-company project.
As for your grades, I guess - though I am not exprienced - the renowned schools in Canada will be equally demanding as in any other part of the world. So, if you aim at studying at the most renowned schools you should try to achieve the highest grades. Also, you may consoder doing the GMAT and achieve 650 or more.
I am not saying that you will not become accepted with lower grades or scores. I am just saying that it increases your chances to become accepted. But even if your grades - for whatever reason - should not be sufficent you can still apply at other schools, even if they are less renowned. This is the reason why I recommend you to dedicate some time for creating an overview of the educational landscape (at least in management) in Canada.
As for the extra-curricular activities, I think they may be considered as an add-on - but they will hardly dtermine whether you become accepted or no. Think of them as something that admissiosn officers take into account AFTER they have decided whether you are capable - in their eyes - for the studies or not.
As for the IELTS (and tests in general), I am confident that mid May should be sufficient for September intake.
Posted by AVINASH777 on 04/01/13 12:21pm
I also wanted to know that what are the chances of getting a job after MIM or I will have to struggle for 2-3 months after my P.G to get a job if i do it from a average college or university.And how much average salary i can expect to get in the first job?
Posted by Thomas Graf on 04/01/13 1:52pm
I understand that these questions are important for you. But theer are as many answers as there are programs and schools.
For example, we did a survey among MIM programs last year (and are currently doign the new one). According to this, the average salary after graduation was around EUR 43,000. But what does that mean? The range was between EUR 10,000 and I think EUR 70,000... depending on the school. Also, the salary has a different purchasing power depending on where you are.
So, to get better results here I recommend you to FIRST do your homework and investigate schools in Canada and assess their reputation. SECOND, check the firms that come to campus for recruitment and clear for yourself which 3, 5, or 7 schools will be on your short list. FINALLY, screen the website of each school (or contact the careerservice teams) to find statistics on the average salary of the RESPECTIVE program. Again, you may find strong differences among schools.
As for the length after graduation until you find a job: In our survey, 90 percent found a job within 3 months aftergraduation. 3 months, actually, is the standard period that publications such as the Financial Times take as a reference to assess the placement ability of a school. But again, there may be difference among the schools and also students. Some students will have a job already some weeks before graduation - here again: Watch out for in-company projects; some will get a job within 3 months; and some will need longer. Try to find out and apply for programs where the third group is small.
Again, sorry that I cannot give you general answers - but I think you understand the diffculty now and that - taking my guidelines - you will eventually need to investigate this program by program.
Posted by AVINASH777 on 04/02/13 9:10pm
Thanks for all your guidelines as it help me a lot in my decision for pursuing MIM from abroad.
I want your help,i am an engineer student but my inclination is towards management and business that's why now i am gonna do MIM but as i come from a technical background,i am little bit confuse on specialization.
I am confuse that in which specialization (Master in Management, Master in Business, Master in International Management, or Master in International Business) i should do MIM more because i don't have knowledge about their basic difference in study and also their scope and future.
Could you please suggest me that which specialization i should take taking consideration that it should have a great future or scope.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 04/02/13 9:45pm
thanks for your question. A Master in Management and a Master in Business are general management or business programs and I don't see a difference. On both programs, you may choose electives or maybe even a concentration - but the idea is that the program provide you with general management knowledge.
A Master in International Management or a Master in International Business are similar, except that they - from the beginning on - signal to you that they have some international focus. This focus can be reflected in courses on international business or diversification - it can, however, also reflected in study trips to a partner campus.
I recommend you compare the curricula and structure of these programs - e.g., choose some schools that you like or heard of, that offer one of these programs - and compare one by one the courses and structure. I think, by this you will easily get a sense of what the differences are (and what you prefer).
Just make sure that you use our Filter "Entry requirements" to find programs for people with your background.
Posted by AVINASH777 on 04/04/13 10:40am
This is Avinash again,i don't have any work experience and that's why i can't give GMAT exam.So will i get admission in well renowned schools in Canada only on the basis of IELTS or i should go for GRE as i found that some schools such as Ivey's,brock university allow admissions on GRE score which they convert it into GMAT score.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 04/04/13 12:06pm
thanks for your message. But why can you not do the GMAT? It is independant of yoru work experience...
Posted by Saptak on 06/26/13 2:06pm
Hi there Thomas ,
I am currently studying my final year in studies in India and is expecting to be graduated in 2014. My question to you is , Can you suggest some good Canadian b-schools for MIM degree ? Is the degree good enough in helping to get jobs after having done the degree from the respective university ? Can you tell me how good is Sauder School of Business under the University of British Columbia for the MiM degree? I would be highly obliged if you help me out regarding the following things.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 06/26/13 4:10pm
thank you for your question. The best way to find out about Canadian MIM programs is following these steps:
All of these suggestions will help you gather more information - and in the same way you can also investigate in the Sauder School - and help you gain more certainty in which program is YOUR program.
Posted by Saptak on 06/26/13 4:50pm
Hi Thomas ,
Its Saptak once again ! Can you tell me how good it is to study the MiM degree in Canada , provided the current economic scenario and the financial strains all over US and Canada ? Can anyone get a good job after passing out with this degree under his/her belt ? For instance an MBA graduate is supposed to get a much healthier salary than a MiM graduate . Is it possible to acquire a better job with having this degree ?
Posted by Thomas Graf on 06/26/13 5:33pm
thank you for yoru question. I am afraid, however, that your question is too general to be answered seriously and such that you take some value from it. Career perspectives, at the end of the day, depend on many things and programs are different from school to school.
In my previous comment, I offered you a road map about how you can find out the specific career chances at a specific school. By this, for instance, you can find out how likely you find a job at Sauder with a MIM program and where.
I understand that investigating in this is tedious and that receiving a simple answer "MIM is great in Canada" or "MIM is equal to MBA" would be easier but I would not be serious to you if I would go into that.
Of course, you may look at macro conditions such as the economy or the fact that the MBA is more renowed than the MIM in North America. But how does it help you in the end? You can study in a low economy country and still get a great job, just because you have a a great education (and provided that you apply at the right employer). But to find out your career chances with a SPECIFIC program (whether MIM or MBA) my recommendation is to follow the road map suggested before.
One more comment because you mentioned the MBA. Please note that the MBA is for professionals and the MIM is for graduates. This means that MBA students pay more than MIM students (on average). And it also means that MBA graduates apply for advanced positions whereas MIM graduates apply for job entry positions. Hence, MBA graduates earn more money than MIM graduates.
Posted by Saptak on 06/27/13 1:41pm
Hi Thomas ,
I want to ask something about my career which I forgot to ask earlier . My question is , will it be safe to study MIM course after having done an honors an English , since I do not have any prior business studies or degrees. What sort of a job can I get with this degree since I am from humanities background ? I guess , a student from finance background will get a different job than a student who has done honors in english and then doing an MiM degree. Looking forward to you hear from you more.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 06/28/13 1:39pm
thank you for your questions. With respect to your academic background, about two thirds of all MIM programs worldwide are open for graduates without academic background in business or economics. You can find them my setting our Entry requirements filter on "No academic background in business or economics required" (isn't that a great service...?)
So you are fine here and most MIM programs are designed for people like you. I struggle, however, a bit about your expression "will it be safe". In fact, nothing is really safe with respect to education, at least in my opinion. You never have a guarantee about jobs you get afterwards as it depends on many thing BEYOND your education. I am convinced, however, that the beter your education the better yoru chances on the job market. And that's the idea behind doing a master: Increasing your job prospects compared to the time before you do the master.
As for the kind of jobs for MIM graduates without a business undergraduate degree, that's a very good question and to my knowledge no one has made a systematic investigation in this. I will include it as a question in our Global MIM Survey 2014, however.
The most effective way to find reliable information right now may be that you contact three of five business schools that you like and that do not require business or economics as acemic degree. Ask them (e.g., the career office team) where the MIM graduates started to work after the MIM (country and company) and what kind of jobs they found (e.g., project manager, marketing, HR, consultant, investment bank analyst etc. are kind of jobs where the undergraduate degree is not necessarily important).
Posted by Saptak on 06/28/13 5:14pm
I want to thank you a lot for the responses you had given along with the priceless information . I am looking forward for your "global MIM survey 2014" to get myself more clear and more affluent in these things.
Thanking you ,
Posted by Thomas Graf on 06/28/13 5:23pm
A pleasure. If you want to link to the MIM Compass, for example from your social bookmark tools, please feel free to do so. The more established other websites link to the MIM Compass the better.
Posted by abhi1989 on 07/25/13 7:29pm
I am an Engineer with almost 2 years work experience now in IT industry.I am looking for MIM in German colleges.My list is HHL Leipzig, WHU Otto, EBS Business School and Manheim Business School.I have got through EBS, but they have asked me to produce a score of gmat with 650 or a little more than that if I need scholarship.My first attempt got me to 530 and now looking to retake.Few more colleges I have selected isErasmus Univeristy, Maastricht -Netherlands and HKUST Hongkong.
Kindly provide some details about how are these universities, placements scenarios in these andthe average GMAT score generally they ask for?
My details- higher secondry 75.8%, senior secondry 75.4% and CGPA in graduation- 6.87IELTS- 7 and gmat score(530, but retaking it with an aim of atleast 650+)
Posted by taras on 07/26/13 9:11am
Hi Abhi,You are from engineering background right?So do the aspirants students from engineering background find a place in HHL,WHU or Mannheim?I am also considering to pursue MIM from german B-Schools but not sure about the universities and their job opportunities there?Which all B-schools from germany did u consider?Any input from your side will be helpful?Regards,Sarat
Posted by Thomas Graf on 07/26/13 12:03pm
thank you for your question. The best way to find out these information (placement scenarios, requested GMAT etc.) actually is through the schools themselves. I recommend you to, first, screen carefully the schools' websites, and, second, contact the schools with any question still left.
On the websites, read carefully the admissions requirements and eligibility parts. Often times, schools publish average GMAT scores - so that you get an idea of what is expected. You should also find statistics on career placements or industries where the graduates work later on.
Though the direct contacts, you get two sorts of information. First, you get - ideally - answers for your questions (e.g., how many percent of your graduates found a job within 3 months after graduation)? And second, you get information ABOUT the school and its culture.. for instance, how fast do they answer you? How polite and friendly and personal? How competent are the answers thyt they give you? This is important since you may not want to study at a poorly managed school.
As for the GMAT, most renowned schools that require the GMAT want to see a minimum of 600 points. Many schools grant a merit-based scholarship only with 650 and more.
As for your selection of schools (listed above) all of them have a certain reputation of providing quality education. The question, however, is: What is the best school for YOU? And that depends on your goals. For example, if you want to work for an investment bank and the school has no contacts to such banks, then maybe the school is not optimal for you, even though it may be renowned for quality. So, try to find that out through the websites and direct contacts.
HAVING SAID all of that, I strongly recommend you considering an MBA program - as opposed to a Master in Management (MIM). MIM programs are for graduates or recent graduates. You are a young professional, however, and the MBA is the right program type for you (given that you search for a general management postgraduate program).
Posted by abhi1989 on 07/26/13 12:12pm
Thankyou for yor reply.What do you suggest for proffesionals with 2 years work ex.MIM or MBA?however by next september we might be eligible for mba also but I guess profile of mba aspirants in these colleges are 5-6 years exp or a master already.Wont it be a lil difficult for us to compete with them, However in MIM we will be on the better side.MOreover after a job of 3-4 years post MIM, we might consider mBA from top Universities worldwide.Its just my thinking, KIndly guide.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 07/26/13 1:49pm
thank you for your question. Let's look first on the formal requirements: With 3 years of professional experience in that moment that you start your studies, any MBA program in the world will accept you. Many schools also accept 2 years although I admit that 3 would be better - just because you have more professional experience then that you can bring into the classroom.
As for the "Take away": Most Masters in Management are for graduates or recent graduates (less than 1 year of work experience). Hence, you will be sitting in a class room with people who don't have much or even no professional experience. In an MBA class, you share the knowledge with other professionals, which is one of the big advantages of an MBA. Also, keep in mind that for MIM programs companies come to campus with entry positions while for MBA graduates they offer advanced positions - again, the reason is that MBA programs are for professionals and MIM programs for graduates.
An alternative may be Masters that target explicitly graduates with a few years of experience - so that you won't do an MBA while still being together with young professionals. The ESCP Europe for instance offers a Master in European Business that recommend 2 years of experience. You find some of these programs if you look for "Masters in Management for Professionals" in our search engine. And you can find it out if screen the websites of your favorite schools (or contact them) for the average work experience of their students. Some MIM programs may have an older of more experienced audience.
To sum it up: I see the following options:
Posted by Ra-h-ul on 01/09/14 6:40pm
Hi Thomas,I'm a IT professional from India. Below is my profile:Education : B.Tech - ITWork Exp: 3 yrs.GMAT score : 590TOEFL Score :100
So far I have been planning for MBA from one of the reputed colleges in Canada but a low GMAT score has hurt my dream and is making me to think about MIM. Please suggest me what should I do now.Also suggest me names of some good business schools (in Canada and Australia), in which I stand a chance to get admission into.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 01/10/14 6:32pm
thank you for your question. As for the GMAT score, I recommend redoing it. I also had 590 at first my first trial and then scored 660.
As for MBA and MIM, these programs are not directly interchangeable. The former targets professionals and attracts employers with advanced positions, the latter is for graduates searching for entry positions. Have a look at our differences between MBA and MIM article. You clearly have an MBA profile.
As for "good" schools, that depends on what YOU want and perceive as good. As a general start, you can look out for schools with an international recognized accreditation. If a school's exposure to the media and employers is important for you, you may also check for schools in management education rankings (e.g., FT MIM Ranking or MBA Rankings).
Most important, however, is that that you search for a program that fulfills your personal and specific preferences with respect to its career services (e.g., are your target employers coming on the campus?), content (e.g. so you learn what you want to learn), and resources (e.g. how much do you want to pay for a Master?). For this you need to analyze the programs one by one.
I also recommend you reading my e-Book "Roadmap to your Master in Business Degree 2014" where I explain these steps in more detail (should be available soon...).
by Thomas Graf
Posted by taras on 07/26/13 9:09am
Hi Abhi,You are from engineering background right?So do the aspirants students from engineering background find a place in HHL,WHU or Mannheim?I am also considering to pursue MIM from german B-Schools but not sure about the universities and their job opportunities there?Any input from your side will be helpful?Regards,Sarat
Posted by Saptak on 07/26/13 9:20am
I would suggest you to sit to try France also ... It has got some good schools and they are quite famous.
Posted by abhi1989 on 07/26/13 11:20am
Hi Sarat,Yes I am from Engineering background and yes I have come across a lot of Engineers who were able to get through these colleges.In general their first preference is students with business background but Engineers with someexperience or good profile/ GMAT score (at times yu can show the credits of the subjects you studied during engineering related to management) and at some places they are also offering a Prep Mastes course for the stduents from non-business background to get acquinted.
Reading from the experience of different people at forums and checking the universities websites, does give some idea about the placement scenario and it looks promising. :)am on the same boat too.
Posted by Saptak on 07/26/13 9:22am
Try cracking the GRE once... I bet you will score a much better score . all the best
Posted by taras on 07/26/13 8:51pm
Hai Abhi,Are you planning to apply in HHL,WHU or Mannheim?And did you speak any of the alumnis from these schools as well as EBS? Did you enquire about the chances of getting a job after MIM from EBS? Do you know anyone personally who have done this particular program from Germany and is working there now? Do you have any idea what kind of positions we would be in once we find a job from EBS?Why didn't you try the French universities?They are much more reputed than the German B-schools i guess.Clarrifications would be appreciated,Regards,Sarat
Posted by Saptak on 07/26/13 8:52pm
Thats what I told him Taras .. that the french ones are more reputed .. :)
Posted by taras on 07/26/13 9:12pm
Hai Saptak,DO you have any idea which is the best option to consider actually-an MIM from Germany or France? My understanding is that since French economy is really struggling at the moment and they are facing high unemployment issues,will it be a wise idea to consider France for higher studies?Also they have only 6 months of stay back options after graduation.On the other hand,German's economy is really great among European countries and they do have good stay back options of 1.5 years.Does these things matter a lot,m not sure?Agreed the French universities are comparably much highly reputed but shouldn't we take into account the economic situation and the stay back options??Regards,Sarat
Posted by taras on 07/26/13 9:15pm
Hai Thomas,DO you have any idea which is the best option to consider actually-an MIM from Germany or France? My understanding is that since French economy is really struggling at the moment and they are facing high unemployment issues,will it be a wise idea to consider France for higher studies?Also they have only 6 months of stay back options after graduation.On the other hand,German's economy is really great among European countries and they do have good stay back options of 1.5 years.Does these things matter a lot,m not sure?Agreed the French universities are comparably much highly reputed but shouldn't we take into account the economic situation and the stay back options??Regards,Sarat
Posted by Thomas Graf on 07/27/13 11:53am
I understand your concerns and thoughts. Indeed, I also think that the region or country around a school is important as contacts to regional employers may be the strongest and provide an advantage for finding a job. The more global a school's reputation, however, the more the potential career impact this school may have in other countries as well.
A German school may have a strong reputation in Germany and provide you with a good chance to find a job here. A very renowned school abroad (e.g. Harvard...) may provide you with a career advantage in any country, however, and for some jobs (not for any jobs though) even be superior to the German school, even in Germany.
If you want to work in France, I would clearly go for the French schools. If you want to work in Germany I would consider the German schools first (ask them about their experience with students of your nationality and their employers after graduation) - but I would also consider the most renowned French schools, e.g., by applying for 3 German and 2 French schools at the same time, and ask them about their placement rates.
In general, I find it very difficult to keep a black and white thinking when it comes to education (e.g., is France better than Germany?). You can always find good jobs, and the better the education the higher your chances. The more finegrained you look at these things the more you find that the probabilities are differently distributed, depending on the specific student's profile. That's why I suggest to ask for a school's experience with students of your nationality. If a school has 10% students from India, for instance, and all of them returned to India after graduation, then you know that probably you will find it hard to find a job in the school's country.
Maybe the schools can also bring you in contact with a student or alum of your nationality. This person can tell you about his or her experience then.
Posted by chinmay on 01/24/14 8:58am
Posted by Thomas Graf on 01/24/14 2:31pm
thank you for your questions. I think the key question - first of all - is whether you want to do a Master General Management (MIM or MBA) or, alternatively, a Master in Marketing (a specialized degree that provides you with in depth knowledge in marketing). To find that out, I recommend you comparing the curricula of these different program types at some renowned school.
If you want to go for general management, then the second question is whether you should go for a Master in Management (MIM) or an MBA. Given that you would have 2 years of work experience when you star a program this fall, you may be able to do both.
What you finally do depends on what you want or need. Here I recommend you focusing on the present time.
If you need management knowledge NOW, do the GMAT and apply for a MIM or even an MBA (better reputation and employers coming to campus with jobs for advanced people). Many programs have deadlines until May or even until the program starts (late August). Also, half of the programs don't require the GMAT at all.
If you do not necessarily need management education now, I would consider wait for another year or two years, take time for the GMAT, and then do the MBA.
Posted by chinmay on 01/26/14 7:49pm
Posted by Thomas Graf on 01/27/14 1:01pm
a simple starting point is by deciding what you want to learn. My personal opinion is that FIRST OF ALL a Master is to learn something and to build up competence. If you build up competence, your chances of finding a job afterwards rises automatically compared to your situation before the Master. Hence, compare the curricula between programs and reflect what you want to learn.
The second (related) question is, what and where you want to work later on. Make a list, for instance, of your 3-5 favorite employers and their competitors and ask yourself, how and in which function you want to work. Then combine question 1 and 2 by asking which competences do you need to develop to have a fair chance of getting recruited.
The next question goes beyond building up knowledge and leads to a school's reputation and career services. You need to find out in advance where your favorite employers recruit and apply only there. You can find this out by (1) screening the schools' websites, (2) asking the school, (3) asking alumni of the specific program (get the contacts through the school), and (4) by asking the employers,
Let's apply this structure now in your context: The actual question is not whether the Master in Marketing is recognized. In fact, every Master per se is "recognized" as a postgraduate degree. The questions are:
Posted by kmba on 01/29/14 2:18pm
Hi Sir,First Let me introduce myself. I am pursuing my Bachelors in Information Technology in India and I am in my 2nd year now ( yeah i still have 30 more months to complete my Undergrads) and I plan to start my preps early. My primary aim is to get into the Management side. Ok now. I have a self made plan for myself.
As of now my co-curricular activities include Organising various events in college and attending the Model United Nations conferences as a Delegate.
Now Sir, what i ask for is a feedback on my plan and if there are any glitches in my plan provide solutions for the same since I am so naive in this.
Thank you :)
Posted by Thomas Graf on 01/30/14 12:21pm
in general, your plan makes sense to me. Still some thoughts:
Choose a school and MIM program where some of your favorite employers (or their competitors) recruit. For instance, most of the renowned schools publish career statistics and employers coming to the campus. You should look out for BCG etc. Also, you can try to build up contact with these consulting firms at career fairs in your country and ask them where they recruit.
As for he MBA, I would ignore that question. Of course, it is good to know that you always have that option. But for the moment, you just need to make sure that your career starts well - and for this a MIM is your tool. Whether you feel the need or just want to do an MBA as well after some years is totally irrelevant today. Maybe you want to do a PhD later on? Maybe you don't want or need another degree then because you are fully happy with your job? Maybe you think after some years that you rather need a special executive seminar (1 week or 2 weeks) in a special knowledge area where you have weaknesses? You will see THEN.
Posted by kmba on 02/01/14 4:43pm
Hey Thomas!!Thanks for the Guidance :) .With this question I know i am Bugging you ;) But still, cant stop asking ;)I still have some questions. Most of the Universities say that GPA and Gmat are just two of the many factors considered during admission. So what are the so called other factors? And if I have a non competitive GPA of like 3/4 then how would I tackle that disadvantage. Now I am asking this out of curiosity. Since most of my relatives and friends live in US i prefer US to EU. But in MiM rankings no US school has made it to the top. so, 1) Will these rankings have any impact on Job Placements. 2) Is it possible to get a job in US after graduating from EU schools? 3) Other than MIT: Sloan does any top reputed schools provide MiMs?Thank You.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 02/03/14 12:25pm
thank you for your questions. In general, schools differ indeed to what degree they focus on the GPA (with or without analytical tests such as GRE or GMAT) and to what degree they also accept people with weaker GPAs. Those that look beyond the GPA usually take into account other activities they did in their lives and that may provide a signal about a person's leadership potential, experience, interest and curiosity, and overall potential for the business world later on. For instance, admissions managers may look at your internships, extra-curricular activities, your own start-up projects, prizes you won, or hobbies. They may also take into account your essays and the interview by the way.
So, if a school does not accept you because of your GPA you can look for schools that openly say on their admissions pages that they include such other factors into their assessment. Moreover, you can try to achieve a great GMAT score (or re-do the GMAT in case you are not satisfied), do an internshop at a renowned firm, build up something interesting in a private initiative (e.g. a non-profit project where you show your management capabilities) and impress people.
As for the US, it is true that Masters in Management are still widely unknown. Most firms know what an MBA is but Masters of Science or Arts in Management (MIM) are new. If you want to work in the US, I recommend doing your education in the US. If you go for a MIM, I would do it at a renowned business school with a renowned MBA. My logic is this one: If a school managed to build up a strong reputation for its MBA, this school likely has a reputation for management education in general. If you do a different degree there - e.g. a MSC in Management - then this reputation likely spills over. In other words, employers that know the school and its MBA may be interested if they receive an application from someone who achieved a different degree from the same school as well.
I recommend you to use our search engine (Program Type: master in general management; Teaching mode: full-time; Entry requirement: business degree not required; Region: North America). Then you check each school particular if their MBA is ranked in Businessweek, US News or Forbes.
Posted by kmba on 02/06/14 3:41pm
Hi Thomas,Thanks again for the answer. I will start preparing for gmat and toefl now on and will also try to bring my gpa to at least 7.5/10..and by the way since my college issues a 10 point grade scale, I tried converting it to a 4 point one using WES iGPA. My current gpa is around 6.5/10 which is not a competitive number , whereas WES gives my GPA as 3.32/4. So hows this even calculated. Also that do the schools in Europe and US ask for a 10 point gpa or a 4 point one. if a 4 point one , then where do i calculate it?Thanks in advance :)
Posted by Thomas Graf on 02/07/14 11:26am
I don't know where to calculate the GPA but I am sure you will find this out easily and soon.
As for the schools, admissions managers often are aware of local differences and - because of that - want to know where (which institution) a specific degree has been earned. Hence, in most cases there is no need to translate the GPA score as the schools do it themselves.
Posted by Ankur2417 on 10/11/14 9:40am
Hey Thomas.I wnt to ask u should I go for Mib in granuble or Mim smwhere else?I have done my b.tech mechanical wth 62%12 th from DPS with 67% nd 10th from DPS with 77%.Wrk ex-nil.I saw ft rankings 2014. Granuble is a highly ranked college. Bt my Preference is doing a MIM programme nd thn wnt to do job in that country only atleast for 2 to 3 yrs...Plz help me should i go for it nd will i get a job in france aftr MIB...Waitng for ur ans. Thanks.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 10/11/14 1:15pm
the question "Should I do this or that" is a very common question among the forum's users. It basically tells me: "I want something - e.g., a job in France - but have no clue what to do".
The starting point to tackle this question such that you really get a satisfying answer that helps you move on is twofold: You need to clearly analyse your goals and resources on one side and match them with MIM programs and schools on the other.
For this, I recommend you to read my MIM eBook. It will help you for both sides of the coin, the look on yourself and the analysis of programs (e.g., how to identify quality programs, compare programs, and finally identify programs that fit your profile).
By Thomas GrafOwner MIM CompassAuthor of the MIM eBook
Posted by Ankur2417 on 10/11/14 1:32pm
Sir m not able to download the e-book... Can u mail me plsss at firstname.lastname@example.org or jst gv the answer here itself..Sir m very mch clear that i wnt to MIM only as i dnt have any wrk ex. Nd gmat i dnt want to give nd in that situation there's only one top university is left which i cn apply e.i Granuble graduate school of business... Jst my confusion is that will i get a reputed job in Europe after my Course... Jst answer me that sir nd if there are some more university acc. to my profile so tell me that too... Thanks
Posted by Thomas Graf on 10/13/14 11:49am
you need to buy the ebook first - then you can download it.
Posted by BlockeeR on 01/29/15 6:45pm
I am a civil engineering graduate who works in the financial services sector. Currently I am pursuing MiM to develop business-related skills and overcome the obstacles I face while looking for a job in this sector. Because I believe that my bachelor's degree does not satisfy most of employers due to the fact that it is not a finance-related degree. What would be your suggestion to give a good direction to my career? Thank you.
Posted by Thomas Graf on 01/30/15 12:25am
why don't you read my ebook first? This will provide with a solid answer to your question (and much beyond).
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